Oppo, Give Me Advice

"Jcarr" (jcarr) 03/02/2016 at 10:54 • Filed to: None

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Our 2005 MkV Jetta has become a bit of a money pit lately and I am ready to pull the plug on it. I’d like to replace it with another midsize sedan, but I’m also open to crossovers and I’ve even convinced my wife that a wagon would be acceptable as well.

Here’s what I’m looking for in order of importance:

Reliablity/Quality/Safety

Low cost of ownership

Availability of parts/ease of service

AWD would be nice, but not mandatory

You’ll notice that good looks, manuels, and fun-to-drive aren’t on there. As much as I’d like those things, at the end of the day I’m a guy with a wife, a son, and a budget, so I’m looking out for my bottom line above all else.

My short list currently (not really in any particular order):

Fusion

Equinox

Sonata/Optima

Accord

6

Outback

Any thoughts on those or other thoughts in general?

AASHOUR6 > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 10:58

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DON’T get an equinox. THE TIMING CHAIN WILL FAIL. Get the fusion they look great and have really nice interiors as well.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:01

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As a Chevy guy, fuck the Equinox with a prickly pear.

Fusion (2.0T AWD for preference, but you might find it a bit small)

Outback 3.6R (only if available with something other than CVT)

6

Nibby > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:01

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FUSION MASTER RACE

/bias

TheHondaBro > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:02

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You looked at a Camry yet? I’d seriously consider a Camry.

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:02

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The Fusion will have to go back to the dealer constantly for interior trim alignments and other quality control issues. On top of all the times my parent’s Fusion has been already, it’s about to go again for a rattle in the headliner. They drive well and the interior presents itself nice but the quality just isn’t there imo.

I’d seriously look at the 6 and Optima. If it weren’t for my dad’s American only rule I’d have almost made certain my mom would’ve got into one of those.

Megamullin > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:02

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Second that. I would be comparing the 6 and the Fusion if I were in your shoes.

Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:03

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I’ve heard good things about the Accord, 6, and Outback. Will this car be the only car in the family?

The Ghost of Oppo > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:03

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The Mazda6 is great bang for your buck, meets requirements 1-3 and it does look good, and you can get it with a manual!

Jcarr > Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer 03/02/2016 at 11:03

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What don’t you like about the Equinox?

My dad is on his second one as a company car. He’s put ~100,000 miles combined on them in about 2.5 years and both were rock solid.

Jcarr > TheHondaBro 03/02/2016 at 11:04

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I have grudgingly. I know I’m looking out for my bottom line, but they’re just so damn boring.

Jcarr > Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] 03/02/2016 at 11:05

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No, we have a 2004 Envoy that my wife DDs and a ‘96 Ranger for beater truck duty.

TheHondaBro > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:07

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Then look for an Accord Sport? Or if you want a manual, Accord V6.

Jcarr > TheHondaBro 03/02/2016 at 11:08

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I’d be cool with a manual, but my wife won’t do it. I do like the Accord Sport.

TheHondaBro > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:09

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I may sound biased, but the Honda CVT is the best CVT I’ve driven, and I’ve driven a Nissan CVT.

mazda616 > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:09

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I have a 2016 6 and it’s a wonderful car. Fun to drive, roomy, plenty of day-to-day power, good gas mileage, great looks, and a good price.

HammerheadFistpunch > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:11

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TSX wagon, and...believe it or not...the new Malibu gets high praise

Stapleface > TheHondaBro 03/02/2016 at 11:17

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Well, the Nissan CVT is the worst I've ever driven. But you're right, I've driven probably 5 different companies CVT, and Honda's is the best, hands down.

Stapleface > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:20

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Since you aren’t looking for fun to drive, might I suggest the XV Crosstrek. It really is a decent vehicle, that's biggest issue is it's hampered by an anemic engine. If you can get over that, it might not be a bad choice at all. I liked mine when I had it, and got rid of it primarily because of the lack of oomph.

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 11:21

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I actually have yet to read anything truly negative about the Malibu, which is... shocking to say the least given the last generation’s complete failure.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:22

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I honestly can’t pin anything down, but I just don’t like them. They may be great for you as a family vehicle, but I had to get that opinion out. I’ll try to pin down some things anyway though.

For me aesthetics are important. I just couldn’t go out to something as hideous and yet still bland as an Equinox every morning. Compared to it the Outback is a supermodel. Heck, even the Juke I could live with.

It’s a mediocre vehicle at best in every conceivable way.

Now if it was the only option you were considering, I’d say go nuts, your tastes are obviously much different from mine and it should work for you, however based on the fact that I like/don’t mind all the others I don’t think that’s the case. I just can’t see having a choice between the Equinox and the Outback and picking the Equinox.

On reliability, most vehicles these days should be bulletproof through 100,000 miles. I can say that the Outback should be the same (my brother has one—280,000km in ~3 years).

If you want a Chevy crossover in the mix, I’d replace the Equinox with a Traverse. More space, better engine, better looks, newer platform (iirc—could be wrong). Starting price is higher, but honestly I’d rather have a demo Traverse than a brand new Equinox.

Sweet Trav > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:24

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Fusion. Fantastic car for the money. An SE 2.0 EB with AWD can be hand for under 30K well optioned.

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Stapleface 03/02/2016 at 11:25

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The XV is actually a great “slow car fast” vehicle. Handles awesome.

Jarrett - [BRZ Boi] > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:25

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I’d go between the Accord and 6, in that case. The Envoy/Ranger combo covers a lot of bases.

Heck, I’d even consider a smaller segment. Myself and my brother sat in the back seat of a Celica, or Ranger jumpseats, as adults, on our trips to the cottage, and we lived! :)

Steve in Manhattan > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:28

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When the answer isn’t Miata, it’s Subaru. Just ask Tom & Ray.

Future next gen S2000 owner > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:32

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Outback with eyesight is the way I would go. Then next a CX5 or 6 followed by the Accord & Fusion as a tie for 3rd.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:32

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I’m not advocating, just sharing. My mom has owned a series of Outbacks and they have all been perfectly adequate, if unreasonably slow, wagons. She must like them since she has owned three so far. She is not what I would call an auto enthusiast.

I’m currently driving a Sonata while my WRX is in the shop. Here are my thoughts on it:

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/the-hyundai-so…

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/will-it-track-…

Dasupersprint - base trim is enough > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:40

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I can’t recommend enough my Optima. If you’re patient like me, you’ll find a manual (2011-2013). They’re the cheapest, cause nobody knows they exist. It’s the family car, we have two kids and the wife loves it! It’s a bargain Accord.

HammerheadFistpunch > Logansteno: Bought a VW? 03/02/2016 at 11:43

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it just placed 2nd in a C&D comparo ahead of the Accord and Camry i was also shocked.

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 11:45

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Wow. I didn't know that. Good job Chevy!

TheRealBicycleBuck > Stapleface 03/02/2016 at 11:45

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The XV is essentially a lifted Impreza which puts it into the small/mid-size category instead of the full-size category. The Outback is closer in size to the other options he listed.

Liam Farrell > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:47

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The resale of the Equinox I think is very low. If that matters for you.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 11:49

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Does it have to be that Gen Fusion?

If you want to save some serious cash and get insane reliability the Gen Fusion before that was rock solid and I even saw a used one (near me of course) 2 days ago that was listed at only 11 thousand with only 25k miles on it. That’s basically a brand new car for 11k.

If you’re going back that far look for a deal on a Milan, not just me pushing Mercury but you get more options for the same money because no one looks for Mercury’s anymore.

Jcarr > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 03/02/2016 at 11:56

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Doesn’t have to be if the price and miles are right. My dad had a 2012 as a company car and it seemed to hold up quite well.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 12:03

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http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/…

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/…

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/…

3 examples of very, very low miles for a very, very good car and at a very, very good price.

Jcarr > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 03/02/2016 at 12:08

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Not bad. I hate the wheels on that middle one, though.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 12:17

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If it was my money I’d pick the first.

The blue one has those terrible wheels like you said and the other one is a terrible color.

But then again you could always swap wheels giving you’re about 6-7 THOUSAND under budget.

Wouldn’t that be nice? I mean, sure, you might like the styling of the other ones better but still.

You can even get a Lincoln MKZ (same car, but bigger 3.5L motor) in your 18k budget with under 50k miles. Low cost of ownership leads you back to Ford though - lower insurance rates.

I was shopping around to trade off the Milan but I’m thinking about keeping it now.

I need to do shocks/struts/spark plugs/intake manifold and valve cover gaskets. It’s been the best car I’ve ever owned reliability wise. it has 102k miles on it and I’ve driven about 60k of them. Only thing that broke in that time is 1 brake caliper.

E92M3 > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 12:24

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The choice is obvious....

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 12:26

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I might be biased but this is the best car I’ve ever owned and would recommend it to anyone.

2013 Ford Fusion SE 1.6L Ecoboost auto with Lux package. I Average 33MPG. Get as high as 38mpg on the highway.

And I’ve had a pretty extensive variety of cars so it means something when I tell you it’s the best one.

- 1985 Chevrolet Chevette CS 2dr Auto

-1999 Ford Crown Victoria Police Interceptor Auto

-1993 Honda Civic Si Coupe Manual (if you are between 25-30 you went thru that stage too so you cant judge me)

-1991 Toyota Soarer Twin Turbo Auto

-1991 Nissan Fairlady 2+2 Twin Turbo Manual

-2008 Dodge Ram 1500 Mega Cab SXT RWD Auto

-2009 Dodge Caliber SXT 1.8L Manual (Don’t ask I’m still asking myself why)

-2009 Chrysler 300 Touring Auto

-2010 Dodge Challenger SRT8 Manual

-2013 Ford Fusion SE 1.6L Ecoboost Auto (still own)

-1993 Mazda 323 base Auto

-1979 Lincoln Continental Auto

-1986 Chevrolet C20 3/4 ton pickup Auto

It has been BY FAR the most reliable vehicle I have EVER owned. In 3 years/35,000 miles I have not needed 1 single warranty visit other than the clear coat peeling on the black VPD wheels which was purely a cosmetic issue. Mechanically this car has been BULLETPROOF.

Jcarr > E92M3 03/02/2016 at 12:52

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Nice idea, but very few of them around.

Jcarr > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 03/02/2016 at 12:53

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That’s good to know. Right now I’m leaning toward a Fusion of some variety (2010-2014). MontegoMan has high praise for the 10-12 gen.

Steve in Manhattan > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 13:10

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There is that ad (Superbowl?) that showed a Malibu stripped of its badges. Fooled me.

E92M3 > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 13:11

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Don’t be afraid to travel for the right car.

HammerheadFistpunch > Steve in Manhattan 03/02/2016 at 13:12

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oh, don’t remind me of the “we found people who don’t know what a chevy is” ad campaign of chevy’s. That being said, i WANT Chevy to have a win...I know it probably wont in a year or two but for now I can enjoy their hard work.

Steve in Manhattan > Logansteno: Bought a VW? 03/02/2016 at 13:18

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My mom has ‘98 Malibu - the perfect grandma car. It’s boring, dark green metallic, and utterly without personality. But it has been reliable for all the years she’s had it (since new). I took her to see Fallingwater about 15 years ago (from DC), and the car performed pretty well, although it wasn’t a joy on the curves. Whoever gets this car will have a time capsule, of sorts.

Steve in Manhattan > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 13:21

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As I have said in this space - please people, buy the SS or Chevy won’t keep making them. And yeah, they’re expensive, but you can bargain. If I needed a car (and I likely never will again) I’d buy one. Or an SRT Viper. Or an SHO. Or some obscure model that showed a manufacturer that someone cares when they make a hot version of something.

HammerheadFistpunch > Steve in Manhattan 03/02/2016 at 13:25

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Agreed, though at this point I think the SS’s fate is sealed.

Steve in Manhattan > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 13:28

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My cousin is a big shot at GM and can have anything he wants for a company car - I pitched the SS, but he pretty much subsists on a steady diet of Buick Lucernes.

HammerheadFistpunch > Steve in Manhattan 03/02/2016 at 13:30

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high in Fiber, the Lucerne

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 14:41

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If you truly want Reliability/Quality and low cost of ownership above all else, none of the cars you listed should be top picks.

The 2004+ Prius is a better choice than all of them.

In terms of safety... just about any car from the past 10 years is plenty safe.

And if you want AWD with your reliability/quality/low cost, then I say get a Ford Escape Hybrid.

And the Prius and Escape should have no issues with getting parts.

Both the Prius and the Escape are also quite practical... with the Escape being better since it’s bigger, but Prius has better fuel economy, reliability and durability.

And with fuel prices being low, it has affected the resale values of hybrids. When I was looking for a car recently, I was eyeing a 2005 Prius for CAD$5000. A year or two ago, the same car would have cost at least $3000 more.

And if you want a cheap wagon, a used Ford Focus wagon or Hyundai Elantra Touring wagon are great choices (was also eyeing a 2010 Hyundai Elantra touring selling for CAD $5000). Typically cheap to buy used, better fuel economy than all the cars on your short list (but not as good as the Prius or Escape hybrid) and, except for the Outback, more practical too.

And note that I have two kids and a budget as well. Only difference is I’m divorced and have the kids with me 50% of the time.

Plus I use my car for things like camping trips and moving the odd bit of furniture.

A car like a Focus Wagon or Elantra touring actually has more space than many midsize sedans.

And from a driving pleasure perspective, a newer Elantra Touring wagon would be the best choice of the 4 vehicles I mentioned, the Focus would probably have the lowest overall costs (dirt cheap to buy, cheap to insure) and the Prius will likely be the most trouble-free, durable and have the best fuel economy.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 03/02/2016 at 14:50

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“- 1985 Chevrolet Chevette CS 2dr Auto”

*shudder*... That one is easily the worst one on your list... or should be.

I’ve seen 4 shitbox Chevettes owned by different family members when I was younger.

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 03/02/2016 at 14:52

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nope this was the worst.

-2009 Dodge Caliber SXT 1.8L Manual (Don’t ask I’m still asking myself why)

I had great times with the Chevette but it was probably one of those “it’s so bad that it’s good” kinda thing.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Luc - The Acadian Oppo 03/02/2016 at 14:57

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What was wrong with the Caliber? I was considering them when I was car shopping not long ago (ended up getting another Focus Wagon).

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 03/02/2016 at 15:08

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Seating position mainly. I’m 5'4" and I kept slamming my right knee in the dash every time I went from the gas to the brake. A clutch pedal extension could've solved this but in factory form it was horrible.

Also for 150hp it was totally gutless. I’ve driven 90hp cars with way more spunk than that had.

Steve in Manhattan > HammerheadFistpunch 03/02/2016 at 15:45

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AWD for those Michigan winters, comfy, and easy to drive. I can’t fault him, much, but it’s a compromise.

Clay...Bill Clay > Jcarr 03/02/2016 at 17:48

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Another vote for the Fusion here. Got a 2014 1.6 6-speed, 18k miles over 15 months, averaging 35 MPG.

The car has been flawless, no mechanical issues whatsoever and only one warranty visit for a small clip on the driver side sun visor that came loose. Heck, even MFT has been basically trouble-free save for the one time the system froze. Roomy, quiet, and as far as midsize family sedans go, fun to drive (especially with the manual). Highly recommended.